Just old age? Or is there anything I can do for my Cavy?

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Jewlee	Just old age? Or is there anything I can do for my Cavy?		Lead	[-]
Posts: 88 07/02/08 08:59 AM	Tags : old, loss of appetite Hi, I'm new to these boards. I've noticed a lot of changes in my Guinea Pig and I thought I'd look it up. After reading through these boards I've realized there are a lot of things wrong with her. I'm not sure if there is anything I can do though. My guinea pig is about 6 years old now. Over the past 2 years she's lost a lot of weight. She used to be quite Pudgy now she's skinny. She doesn't eat like she used to at all. She is terribly picky. I have 3 different kinds of food for her and treats and everyday she seems to like less and less. Her teeth are also slanted and it almost seems that a second tooth has decided to grow in front of one of the bottom ones. She's also always had crusty eyes and has never cleaned her nether regions. I've just recently noticed there is not a lot of poop or pee in her cage. I clean it three times a day and there used to be a fair amount each time. When I put new food in her cage she always comes out to investigate and eats a bunch of it has a drink then goes back to sleep in her house. And she sleeps almost all day. She still purrs when I pet her and doesn't seem to be in pain when I pick her up (She hates being picked up though, struggles to be free, always was like that) There are no vets near by that specialize in anything but dogs and cats. So I don't think taking her to any of the vets in my city would help. Are these common symptoms of old age? Is there anything I can do that doesn't require a vet? How long do guinea pigs generally live for? Any advice would be greatly appreciated
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Jewlee	Update	#1	[url]	[-]
Posts: 88 07/02/08 09:51 AM	Well as an update I'm outside with my Guinea Pig (I never really named her, I just call her Gimmie Pig, long story) Shes munching on grass like there's no tomorrow. She loves grass. She just eats and eats and eats it. And its really nice grass out here right now:P So maybe she's just really picky! Because she has a good appetite right now. One thing I'v noticed with her age is that she gets softer every year. When I first got her, her hair was coarse. Now its super soft. Is this common? I'm starting to think now that its her teeth that are the problem. She drools a lot. After her grass munching I had to wipe her chin a lot. She was covered in green liquid :P Oh and I just weighed her. She's 1.8 pounds. Is that good or bad? :P Thanks to anyone who replies!
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PooksiedAnimals		#2	[url]	[-]
Posts: 4114 07/02/08 11:37 AM Moderator	Six years old is pretty good for a pig. Normal life span is 5-7 years old. I'm working through your questions backwards: 1.8 pounds is not too bad, depending on her build. You've said she's lost a lot of weight, and if you don't normally weigh her, she's lost at least 3 oz, if you can feel the difference. Many pigs seem to hover around the 2lb mark. Hair coarseness can depend on breed and diet. A good pig with a good diet will have smoother hair than a bad diet. But if you have a teddy pig, which has coarse-kinky hair, no amount of a good diet will make that smoother! She's screaming heart issues. The drooling, tooth issues, picky eating, weight loss, crusty eyes - every single one of those symptoms are related to heart. If the heart is bad enough, and there's enough fluid on the lungs, she's picky eating and losing weight because she has the choice to eat or breathe. Pigs choose to breathe, and therefore don't eat enough. I've seen this first-hand - its not a pretty way to go. She likely has molar issues, which are seen in many heart pigs, and that causes the slanted front teeth, the drooling, and the problems eating, too. You really need to get her to a cavy-savvy vet. Even if xrays are inconclusive on heart issues, I would push for heart medication - from all accounts, the response is miraculous. The one heart pig I had never got on the proper medication, but just the lasix alone (which took fluid off of the heart) made her gain wait, and stop drooling. She was suddenly more active. It was amazing. Depending on how long her teeth have been overgrowing, that may need to be addressed, too - but a lot of her symptoms would go away with the proper heart medication. I would call around for an exotics vet. Call your local vet and get a recommendation for one that specializes in guinea pigs. I know when I called locally looking for a vet, many wouldn't take pigs - but had the phone number of those that did. Good luck with her. Edited to add: The lessening amount of poops is also an indication she's not eating enough. Less input = less output. You may need to start hand feeding her a pellet mush/slurry with a syringe. If you can purchase Critical Care at a vet, its a lot easier to mix and manage than ground up pellets - but either will do. If she's not getting enough to eat, her body will go into starvation mode and start to shut down. Last Edited By: PooksiedAnimals 07/02/08 11:46 AM. Edited 1 time.
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Jewlee	I'm pretty sure its her teeth	#3	[url]	[-]
Posts: 88 07/02/08 04:50 PM	After more close examination I think its her tooth, I opened her mouth and the second tooth is so long. It reaches the roof of her mouth. I've been looking up vets the closest ones are an hour a way. I've also read that they put them to sleep to do the procedure. I don't think my guinea pig would live from the anesthesia. I wish there was something I could do on my own
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Jewlee	I found a vet!	#4	[url]	[-]
Posts: 88 07/02/08 06:01 PM	Ive found a vet that is 20 min away! I called and it was busy so I'll have to call back. Good news though :)
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PooksiedAnimals		#5	[url]	[-]
Posts: 4114 07/02/08 07:10 PM Moderator	From what I understand, planing the molars would require putting her under anesthesia. An initial examination wouldn't require anesthesia, and neither would an xray. That's great that you found one so much closer! Good luck at the vets!
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Jewlee	An appointment has been set	#6	[url]	[-]
Posts: 88 07/03/08 10:52 AM	Well I got an appointment for Friday at 5:15. I hope she makes it till then :/ They said they vet that is more experienced comes in on Monday though. I'm taking her anyway to see what they can do. I tried giving her soft food last night like apple and strawberry she only ate a bit of the apple. She ate a bit of cucumber this morning and shes drinking lots. I hope she makes it till her appointment! I have to work all day and tonight too so I won't get to see her :/ My Mom will be home tonight though so I'll make sure she looks after her.
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PooksiedAnimals		#7	[url]	[-]
Posts: 4114 07/03/08 11:26 AM Moderator	You want to be careful with the fruit - too much sugar will upset the digestive tract. The best thing for hand feeding is crushing pellets, soaking them in water, and syringe feeding her. You can either get a needle-less syringe at a vet or pharmacy, or something similar to it at the grocery store (look in the baby food/medication isle). You can try mixing this mash with baby food or canned pumpkin. Baby food squash is my favorite, because its high in fiber - which is what they need to keep their system moving. Many people use the 1ml syringe, with the tip cut off. I find it easier to use a 3 or 10ml syringe, if you can get one. A 1Kg pig needs about 50ml of pellet mash a day, just to maintain weight. You need to be aggressive with this, if she's not pooping a lot. Good luck with the vet appointment.
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Jewlee	Thank you :)	#8	[url]	[-]
Posts: 88 07/03/08 12:07 PM	Wow thanks a lot for the info :) I think I have a syringe that will work from when my rabbit had problems ( I had to syringe feed him pineapple juice, he hadn't pooped at all for 2 days, but was eating lots. thats was scary! ) I think i'll try the baby food squash if I can get some. I hate when animals are sick. I'm sitting here at work worried to death, wishing i could be home with her.
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Jewlee	Oh The Agony!	#9	[url]	[-]
Posts: 88 07/03/08 02:22 PM	This day has dragged on so long! I called my house as soon as i knew my sister would be up ( she works nights) and asked her to check on my little pig! I told her to grate carrot into mush and she said she held out her hand and my little baby ate it all so fast. She said it was so sad! I asked her to do the water soaked pellets next. So I think this is good news!
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Jewlee	:(	#10	[url]	[-]
Posts: 88 07/03/08 09:28 PM	She seems to get worse and worse as time continues on. I hope she makes it to her appointment. My sister was able to get her to eat mushed up carrot from her hand and apple and a bit of mushy pellet. She seems to hate the pellets though. That was at about 3. I got home at 9:30 it didnt look like she touched anything i left her. She won't come out of her igloo when i lift it she just trys to run back in and shes so skinny now much skinner than two days ago. I syringed fed her water since she isnt going to her bottle. I had been bringing the bottle to her and squeezing to help her out. She won't accept anymore food. I had her upside down and she seems to be trying to wear the tooth down herself, she scrapes it sideways across her molars. Well I'm hoping she stays strong. And I hope the vet can do good for her! I've been reading these forums all day and feeling sad for all the lost guinea pigs :( I can see PooksiedAnimals has been a huge help in so many areas. PS. I read your profile. You're a software engineer thats awesome! Thats what I'm going to school for right now. And I'm doing my co-op in a IT department. I don't do much coding though :P I like it but I sort of suck at it right now, so I'm not sure if thats what I'll end up doing (coding).
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PooksiedAnimals		#11	[url]	[-]
Posts: 4114 07/04/08 06:17 AM Moderator	She's not getting enough to eat. She will continue to decline. Any way you can get her to the vet before 5pm? Pigs will often fight when being hand fed. I should have mentioned this earlier. Its force feeding. You need to get the food into her system. Although you need to be careful not to asphyxiate her, you need to get it in. She may spit some out, but as long as she's chewing, she's getting some in. She sounds like a fighter, to be still hanging in. But the lack of food will do damage to her internal organs, which is very hard to recover from. I am very worried for her. As for me - yeah - software engineer into guinea pigs. Who knew! Actually, right now I'm not doing a whole lot of coding, which I miss. And I come from old-school programming - where you had to write the code. This object-oriented stuff still confuses me! I love the problem solving, though, and the satisfaction of knowing people use the software I wrote. :-)
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Jewlee	:/	#12	[url]	[-]
Posts: 88 07/04/08 07:14 AM	Dammit. Yeah I don't think shes going to make it. I hope she will but I don't think so. I can't get her there before 5. I don't know if she'll make it till then. Even if she does I don't think she'll recover even if they help her. I'll call my sister and tell her to try and force feed her once she gets home. Gimmie is basically anorexic now. Its strange how she seemed to get sick so slowly but now its happening so fast. I wish I would have recognized the warning signs sooner. I just thought weight loss came with old age. I never read up on anything because I had never had problems with her before. Only with my rabbit, Gimmie was my strong pet. She won't let me touch her now she keeps moving away inside the igloo. This morning I force fed her water with a syringe and she didnt fight at all when I had her on her back. Can't believe how small she is. She isn't peeing or pooing either. I'm suprised she made it through the night. I sort of already said my goodbyes to her. It would be a miracle if she recovered. Well we shall see by tonight if recovery is in her future. Thank you for all your help. PS. Thats the only thing I like about coding is when what you've done is used and appreciated by others.
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PooksiedAnimals		#13	[url]	[-]
Posts: 4114 07/04/08 08:19 AM Moderator	They hide their illnesses so well. They are tricky to care for because of that. I've had to learn the hard way on at least a few pigs before I got the hang of it. Hugs to you. Good luck with Gimmie.
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Jewlee	........	#14	[url]	[-]
Posts: 88 07/04/08 08:40 AM	Thank you! Crap I just read the "Sexing" pages and I think Gimmie is a boy now :P Dammit. I had such a hard time following diagrams when I first tried to sex "it" after reading that though I'm thinking he's a boy. I'm so confused though. Either way its genitals get dirty quite often and I have to clean them. So I guess it is a boy. All these years. I've been so ignorant! I really should have read up on everything. But then I would have probably been paranoid that he had every problem listed. It's been a good 6 years either way. Guinea pigs are great pets. I'm prepared to have a terrible weekend with possible tears. Wish I didnt work all day saturday..
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Jewlee	Back from the vet Piggy is still alive!	#15	[url]	[-]
Posts: 88 07/04/08 07:51 PM	Update time. When I got home Gimmie looked terrible. I syringe fed him water but I didnt get a chance to give him any food because we had to leave right away for his appointment. I have this sort of house that was an attachment on one of the bunnies cages. Its pretty big though I put in a cushion and a blanket and put Gimmie in. During the car ride he looked so sad! I couldn't stop crying when I looked at him. He half layed down and always had his eyes open not blinking at all. Almost looked like he was dead. I tried to stop crying before we got there but the tears just kept coming. I hate it when animals suffer. So I was a mess when we got inside. Once it was his turn to go in we took him out and the vet looked him over and agreed that the front teeth were too long and that he was very sick. Checked his tummy and heart and breathing. Then weighed him 616 grams :( Then they took him away and all I heard was the buzzing sound of a sander. It was hard to wait the 15 minutes they had him. They said he just layed there while they did it. When he came back his teeth were so small!!! Like I didn't know they were supposed to be that short! Or I would have brought him a long time ago! They also clipped his nails better and cleaned his ears. (I clip his nails but i dont like to go too short because he screams when im cutting his nails)(But they weren't that long) She gave me critical care to give him, medicine to get his digestive system working again since he hasn't eaten. And antibiotics because his eyes are a little crusty. I'll put a price list of the visit if anyone wants an idea. All prices in Canadian dollars Checkup : $50 Nail trim: $12 Novotrimel 200/40mg Oral Susp: $11.75 Cisapride 2mg/ml Strawberry Flavour: $17.30 Critical Care for herbivores per gram: $8.60 So with the taxes it came to $105 Looking at that now I'm thinking where is the tooth trimming? I guess it got included in the nail trim Anyway I'm happy I thought it would be more, I have the money anyways. So the car ride home was just as sad. He looked very weak. And his mouth is now permanently open. I don't know if thats the reaction to having it open for 15 minutes or that hes not used to having half the amount of front teeth. At home I completely cleaned out his cage and gave him the first doses of his medicine (0.15ml and 0.3 ml) And about a teaspoon of the critical care (mixed up of course) He didnt fight me when I fed it to him on his back. I gave him lots of water through a syringe too. An hour later I did more critical care (they gave me a crappy syringe that wont even take up the mixture so i used a spoon instead. I got about another full teaspoon in him. He seems now to be getting some strength back. I'm going to let him rest though it was quite the stressor to be in the car and at the vet. So now my question is how much critical care should he get a day? They didnt really tell me. The vet said something that sort of bothered me too. She said if he doesn't eat in a week you have to bring him back and we'll Euthanise him. I thought that was a little mean to be saying. In the end it is my decision what I want to do since he is my pet. I don't want other people deciding for me. Theres no way he could live a week without eating anyway so if he is living in a weeks time its because he has been. No ones euthanising my Gimmie! They want to eventually cut the back molars too but not until he gets better. So no one else has had teeth overgrowing problems? Or do you get your guinea pigs teeth trimmed too? What sort of things do you give them to chew on? None of my animals have liked anything i've tried. Last Edited By: Jewlee 07/04/08 07:58 PM. Edited 1 time.
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WheeksandSqueeks	Re: vet appointment	#16	[url]	[-]
Posts: 183 07/04/08 09:39 PM	I'm so glad your little guy is doing okay! Hopefully he starts eating on his own. Did the vet say anything about maybe the heart problems? One of my first guinea pigs had some of the same symptoms you said and I think he was only around 2 years old ( I got him at a Petstore.) When he had contracted a URI, the vet was going to give him an injection and he had a heart attack. I think he had heart problems all along. As for your vet saying that if he doesn't eat in a week! Holy cow. Banfield told me that if mine didn't eat in three days call and that was way too long. I'd be calling back to an emergency vet if he hasn't eaten anything by tomorrow. If Gimmie isn't fighting you when you feed him, that's not a good sign. Is he making any sounds at all and is he shaking? If you notice any of these things I would call immediatly. I wish you and Gimmie many blessings.
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Jewlee	?	#17	[url]	[-]
Posts: 88 07/04/08 11:02 PM	Why is it bad if he's not fighting me? Doesn't that mean he wants to eat? He only doesnt fight me if hes on his back if hes on his front he fights So if he doesn't start eating on his own in 3 days he never will? I just figured as long as he was accepting food that meant he was eating. I think he's improving since he got up and walked around and hadn't done that in a few days. I don't want the vet to put him down :/ I hate euthanasia. I had to do it to my dog and it was the worst day of my life. She checked his heart and didnt say anything or suggest any tests. I think if he had heart problems he would have had a heart attack when they did his teeth :\ He's not shaking or making any noise. He purred when i pet him in his igloo. He hasnt gone for food himself since wednesday. But he gladly accepted mashed carrot from my sister. and now with the feeding he swallows everything i give him. Last Edited By: Jewlee 07/04/08 11:05 PM. Edited 1 time.
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PooksiedAnimals		#18	[url]	[-]
Posts: 4114 07/05/08 07:19 AM Moderator	A fighting pig means they still have spirit. They haven't given up. On the other hand, my pigs tend to like Critical Care, and will suck it down like there's no tomorrow. If a pig is slurping it up, great! If they're fighting you tooth and nail, that's not bad. If they're sitting there, not fighting you, but spitting out the food, or not eating, that's a very bad sign. You should feed him upright (feet down). Feeding him on his back could cause him to choke. The Critical Care package should say on it. I forget how much water to powder it is (I'll have to look it up) - I know I mix mine a little on the thin side, because its easier to syringe. It is 50cc of mixed Critical Care per kg of pig. Since your guy is around 600g, he needs about 30cc (ml) of Critical Care daily. And because he should be gaining weight, if he wants more than that, by all means, give it to him! If you can weigh him on a kitchen scale, you'll be able to watch his progress and adjust the critical care as needed. Ack - I'm trying to catch up on your whole post. If I miss answering anything, post it again. I am concerned that all your vet did was just his four front teeth. Did he take xrays of the molars? Did he plane the molars, too? If all he did was the front teeth, and nothing with the molars, he did no good. If the molars are out of alignment, and the front teeth don't meet, he won't be able to eat on his own for a while. Can you see if the front teeth meet when his mouth is closed? Very few vets are on board with guinea pig heart trouble. Most vets will discount it out of hand. It usually requires a lot of arguing and persuasion on the owner to get heart treatment for a pig. I do not agree he'd have had a heart attack getting his teeth done if he had had heart problems. Guinea pigs should have unlimited hay to chew on. Its great for their digestive tract, but its important for tooth health. Having not known in my younger years how important hay is, I've had guinea pigs both with and without. And I was amazed at what a difference it made in keeping their teeth in good working order. They didn't chew on as many things (like their wooden house), and the teeth stayed shorter. I have been lucky enough not to have dealt with molar issues myself. Also concerned that his mouth is hanging open. Has it closed yet? I would worry the vet dislocated the jaw. I do not agree with the 3 day limit on eating on his own. If everything is good, he could be perking up and trying to eat on his own in a few days, but it could take many more days of feeding him critical care and watching his weight and all for him to get better. How many days of medication were you given him? And what was the concentration of the Novotrimel? Should I read that as 200mg/40ml? Oh, naw, I bet its 240mg/5ml, which is standard concentration. And how many times a day are you giving him that a day? And did the vet tell you why he was giving you that antibiotic for? How is Gimmie today? Last Edited By: PooksiedAnimals 07/05/08 07:22 AM. Edited 1 time.
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Jewlee	Getting better me thinks	#19	[url]	[-]
Posts: 88 07/05/08 08:19 AM	Well last night I got up every 3-4 hours to give gimmie water and food. This morning he seemed a lot better yesterday. He got out of his igloo and walked a bit. Which he hasnt done in a while. And now hes fighting me a bit when i feed him (kicking me lol) Ok I'll start feeding him right side up but I think he'll really fight me then. I've been careful not to choke him, feeding very slowly and waiting till he swallows. It was almost like having a paralysed piggy before though. s Yeah mouth is still open :/ I really hope she didnt dislocate his jaw! he grind his back teeth though still. Oh and about the back teeth she said that she would have to put him out to fix them so she'll have to wait till he gets better. She said that the back teeth were "floating" I don't know what that means. As for the medicine the Novotrimel does say 200/40mg on the bottle. He only gets 0.3ml every 12 hours though. And the other one is 0.15 every 12 hours. He seems to lay to one side too and his head seemed to be slanting that way. But now that he has more strength it seems to be a bit better. He came out and went to his food dish and moved around the pellets this morning but didnt eat any :P Very picky still. So I put in some red leaf lettuce. I think I'm doing ok with the critical care. I just give him as much as he'll take before he really fights me off. Which is probably 5ml each time and he gets it every 3-4 hours so yesterday he probably had around 15cc and that was because i didnt get to start till 7 at night. So I'll just make sure as much as he's taking is the required amount. Sadly I don't have a small scale. And what sucks is I have to work again today. My sister is on babysitting duty. She said she would feed him food and water every 3-4 hours for me. Perhaps I could get my Mom to get me one. I dont know if his teeth meet either but i'll have to wait till he gains weight and strength before they can do anything about the molars. All my pets have always had unlimited hay available for them to eat. Gimme loved eating it when he was healthy. Our one rabbit wont touch it though no matter what. The medication is to be given till it runs out. So you think that dose was too high? I believe she said the antibiotic was because his eyes were a bu pussy and nose? And skin was a bit dry. I wish she would have talked to me more. I still dont like her threat of euthanasia! If I see improvement in Gimmie no matter how slow I want to give him a chance to get better. Well I hope today goes alright. I trust my sister in taking care of him. He's peeing lots now and slowly pooping. Thanks for your help :) I will update tonight at around 8:30 probably
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WheeksandSqueeks	Good for Gimmie!	#20	[url]	[-]
Posts: 183 07/05/08 10:27 AM	Since he's on a lot of medication and antibiotics I would really keep an eye out for diarrhea. I am so glad he is eating and gaining strength back!
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Just old age? Or is there anything I can do for my Cavy?

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